I just wanted to take a few minutes to congratulate the people and government officials of Leavenworth and State officials of Kansas. For what you ask? For passing the buck. For trying to avoid doing their part in the war on terror. For proving to the rest of the world that you are as country as a chicken coop. City leaders along with Governor Sibelius and Senator Brownback have their Big John Bib Overalls all in a bunch over the possibility of Gitmo prisoners coming to Fort Leavenworth. They cite safety concerns, they say the Military prison cant hold these alleged enemy combatants. I say bullshit. Leavenworth exists because of two entities. The military and the Federal Bureau of Prisons. Take away the army and the federal joint and Leavenworth would dry up and fade into nothingness.
Here are just a few of the reasons being given for not sending Gitmo prisoners to Leavenworth.
1. Close proximity to the Missouri River, a major rail line and several state and federal highways, as well as the city of Leavenworth.
2.Police Department resources would be significantly taxed.
3. Increase in the number of protests in the city.
4.Hazardous material is routinely transported on the rail line running through Leavenworth. That would create a “heightened risk” should any of the detainees escape or if something else happens.
Just to name a few.
Here are just a few of the reasons being given for not sending Gitmo prisoners to Leavenworth.
1. Close proximity to the Missouri River, a major rail line and several state and federal highways, as well as the city of Leavenworth.
2.Police Department resources would be significantly taxed.
3. Increase in the number of protests in the city.
4.Hazardous material is routinely transported on the rail line running through Leavenworth. That would create a “heightened risk” should any of the detainees escape or if something else happens.
Just to name a few.
The military prison in Leavenworth shouldn't be confused with the U.S. Penitentiary, the gitmo inmates would go to the military joint not the USP. That said both are chock full O' killers and some highly dangerous men. They are far more dangerous and a much greater risk to the general public than a few hundred non English speaking middle easterners. The people of Leavenworth have benefited for a long time off of the revenue and commerce created by the military and federal prison industry, so why are they so up in arms over the Gitmo inmates? Simple, and sad, the hype and hysteria are nothing more than ignorance and a chicken little mentality.
Visions of jihad's in speedboats breaching the banks of the river and invading Leavenworth are right out of a bad Rambo movie. If anyone was going to try to break these guys out don't you think they would have entered Cuba and done so already? Cuba ain't exactly a friend of the U S , so it's not like they are going out of their way to keep Americas enemies at bay. Lets say a dozen Gitmo inmates escape from Fort Leavenworth. They are going to stick out like a sore thumb, after all Leavenworth isn't exactly awash in Middle Eastern folks. Now lets say a few of the already incarcerated bad guys from either of the two Leavenworth prisons were to escape. I think it's safe to say that there are some highly trained military prisoners who could wreak havoc while blending in. What I'm saying here, is that the prisoners the folks of Leavenworth should fear are already in Leavenworth.
In a nutshell the people of Leavenworth are paranoid about these foreigners, they have visions of suicide bombers walking in to the local Git n Go, planes flying in to the water tower, or whatever non plausible scenario that comes to mind. Leavenworth, you exist because of the Military and The Bureau of prisons. You have gotten fat from sucking at the Government tit, with little or no complaint about the thousands of killers and nefarious characters housed there. You don't get to pick and chose how your cash cows produce milk. Now wipe that milk mustache off and quit getting all worked up over the possibility of a couple hundred new prisoners, who think The Flintstones is a documentary. The guys you should be afraid of are already in your backyard.
Hat tip jools.
It's just another case of people finding a way to get their names in the papers. Nothing more.It's like a form of "Munchausens Syndrome", like those people who kill their children for the attention. If you checked, those people in Kansas don't really care about the gitmo prisoners. But the prisoners are in the news so they saw a chance to wedge their way into the media spotlight.
ReplyDelete"Hey Mom! Look at me!"
"Hey Mom! Look at me!"
"Hey Mom! Look at me!"
"Hey Mom! Look at me!"
Otherwise, who really cares or even remembers that there is something in Leavenworth Kansas besides the prisons?
"What's more, Geneva Convention rules and U.S. law forbid housing enemy combatants with military prisoners charged with criminal offenses." And, there is only one maximum security wing in the prison..the rest is minimum security. So where are they to go?
ReplyDeleteFurther, there is no hospital on site and the prisoners would have to be transported through town to a hospital...perhaps the VA...wouldn't that be a kick in the teeth to our own veterans...and did you know the average visit to the doc by these creeps is 4 times a month?
And the ACLU finds Supermax in Colorado completely unacceptable since it would be like going from the frying pan to the fire to quote them. Poor fu..ing babies.
And military prison/town/whatever you want to call Leavenworth, as a citizen of Kansas I believe I have a right to be pissed off at the thought of painting a big bulls-eye on me and mine because some cry-baby liberals think Gitmo, where the prisoners get menus for their friggin dinner, is a scourge on our reputation.
I suggest SanFrancisco, right square in the heart of Code Pinko or similar site.
Why not put them in one of the Blue States: California is always good, they have Alcatraz, NY or just somewhere in Chicago? No matter how remote is the chance of things happening, people have the right not to want that shit in near proximity. I personally don't.
ReplyDeleteI've suggested just putting them in the old Wards Catalogue Center, now Super Flea in my neighborhood. 1) plenty of room, 2) all the cops are already over here most of the day, 3) they'd blend right into the Super Flea crowd.
ReplyDeleteJOOLS,
ReplyDeleteI find it strange how short sighted you are. Do you really think that they would put the Gitmo prisoners in minimum security? Do you really think the federal government would parade the Gitmo prisoners through town to receive medical services at the VA hospital? The federal government blows 10 billion dollars a month in Iraq to maintain security, run base camps, build temporary shelters, and provide medical services through field hospitals. Did the thought ever occur to you that they might spend a tiny fraction of that amount to upgrade the facilities at Leavenworth to handle the Gitmo detainees? Nah, they'll just pull up in a panel van and dump the prisoners outside the county lock up. Sure ...
Think about it. This transfer would spark a building boom at the prison to create facilities to house the goons and provide medical care. That's hundreds of new construction jobs and dozens of new jobs at the prison.
Finally, MM is totally righ about the threat of the Gitmo detainees compared to the hardened riff raff already present. There are more killers and sociopaths with a better understanding and capability to do more harm than good already sitting there. If the folks in Kansas are upset about letting illiterate goat herding jihadists in, then I say close down all your current prisons full of serial killers. Obviously, in that case, the State of Kansas can't handle the problem people it already has and shouldn't be allowed to continue to operate such facilities.
What a bunch of morons.
Okay, I understand the reluctance of people to house these guys, so now what? Fort Leavenworth already has a SHU program, which is supermax type security. Again, there hasn't been any incident where outsiders bum rushed gitmo, so why all the alarm that they will attack Leavenworth? I'm close to Leavenworth as well, and if they had a military facility here in KC, I wouldn't be worried about a retalitory attack or break out. I just think it is much adieu about nothing.I'm not discounting anyones fears here, but I think thats what is at issue, fear rather than reality.
ReplyDeleteIt's the same reason people don't want a nuclear power plant next door,or radioactive storage facility, or other crap -shit happens and everyone wants it to happen to someone else. Obviously the people who were concerned with GITMO the most should be willing to put up with consequences of their actions.
ReplyDeleteHey.
ReplyDeleteThe maximum security detention center in Leavenworth is built for the most dangerous people in the U.S., and there are only one or two others like it in the U.S.
And try these on for a few factoids:
"- Almost every member of the Army's top brass has spent at least several months, if not longer, in Fort Leavenworth;
- More than 90 percent of Army captains take a nine-week course there;
- More than 50 percent of all majors spend a year at Leavenworth before they are eligible for promotion to lieutenant colonel;
- of those majors who make it to general, the percentage is much higher….
Leavenworth is where military doctrine is written.
It was Leavenworth's School of Advanced Military Studies that, in 1990, outlined the strategy for Operation Desert Storm.
When the U.S. intervenes overseas, the phones and computers at Leavenworth work overtime."
Leavenworth’s Battle Command Training Program runs simulated war games, for example, ‘Prairie Warrior’, an annual exercise in which computers link Leavenworth with other U.S. Military installations around the world in ‘virtual’ war situations.
Leavenworth is where we write military strategy.
These guys in Leavenworth build our military management and they plan our future military strategy .
This is serious shit.
Leavenworth may be a prison town, but it’s also one of the safest fucking towns in the world for obvious reasons.
I highly recommend reading "An Empire Wilderness" by Robert D. Kaplan. Chapter 1 is entitled "Fort Leavenworth". Kaplan goes into great detail about what really goes on in Leavenworth. Collin Powell helped get the Buffalo Soldiers monument there. He spent a year in Leavenworth.
No fuckin way 200 dirtbag arabs in maximum security or their comrades are going to get away with anything in that town.
Leavenworth – a prison town with sooo much more.”
Yes, fear is what is motivating me the most from a personal basis. Who among us thinks the U.S. is safe from a terrorist attack anywhere? We aren't. I am not concerned with one of them escaping. What Jihadists do is create horror to bring attention to their "cause". They don't care if they die in the process and they sure don't care if innocents do. I don't want to give them an excuse to create that horror here.
ReplyDeleteThey should leave Gitmo open and invite an ACLU lawyer or international human rights group to stand guard over each one of them every day; feed them caviar if necessary, to prove they aren't being mistreated, and get the trials over with THERE.
Thanks for the hat tip MM. Interesting debate.
When I listen to people who worry about jihadist attacks in the midwest, I'm reminded of what one Army general told my Army Reserve unit back in early 2002 just a few months after 9/11. Our Reserve Center is in Manhattan, KS, and there were all these security protocols put in place to secure the facility in the months after 9/11. When the general came to visit, he chuckled and brought everyone down to earth. He reminded us that most people in the Army don't even know where our Reserve Center is let alone the terrorists, and if by some wild happenstance a terrorist wanted to make the multi-hour drive out from the nearest major city to conduct an attack on Manhattan, KS, they would be more likely to target the sewage treatment plant down the street than bother with our building.
ReplyDeleteSo let's put this in perspective, no one has ever made a jail break out of Leavenworth. It is one of the most secure locations in the world, and it's located in the middle of an Army fort which in turn is surrounded by a sea of farmland and towns populated by white, heavily armed Midwesterners in whose midst the arrival of any group of foreign nationals stands out like a sore thumb. Add to this equation that we're near the exact geographic center of the nation with the nearest foreign border or ocean shore more than a thousand miles away, and you begin to see why Leavenworth is probably the best choice for our nation to house these jihadists.
And yes, I would be happy to have them imprisoned in a supermax facility next door to me in Missouri, and I know I wouldn't be alone in welcoming the opportunity. I can almost guarantee if the federal government went to a small Missouri town like Raytown or Belton, and said, "We want to build a state of the art prison here and create hundreds of jobs for your local economy." The residents of those towns would sell their first born children at the chance to house the jihadists. They wouldn't be like you folks in Kansas who are bunch of chicken-little-the-sky-is-falling, paranoid panzies.
Oh, and as for the illiterate goat herding line I made earlier, I apologize for the gross generalization. However, you have to keep in mind that many of the Gitmo prisoners are low level foot soldiers they picked up in the mountains of Afghanistan, and not the college educated Saudi citizens who flew the planes into the towers.
Good post. But I've got a bone to pick with one of your statements:
ReplyDelete"Visions of jihad's in speedboats breaching the banks of the river and invading Leavenworth are right out of a bad Rambo movie."
Sounds like a really GOOD Rambo movie to me.
while i agree with most of this post, i have to disagree with one thing. Having lived in leavenworth for 6 years, i know for a fact it has not "gotten fat" from the military and fed. gov. Leavenworth is a sad little town, full of crime, drugs and violence. Just like any other place. I think both these entities keep Leavenworth afloat, but they by no means make it an affluent city. And fat? Most assuredly not.
ReplyDeleteBefore anyone volunteers for detainees you need to consider the people who will follow them. Regardless of where the detainees are located, the "facility" is going to be secure. The military or federal government will make sure of that. What you need to think about is, what are the supporters willing to do to make life outside the detention site difficult. The supporters embrace death as much as you value life. Look what a group of terrorists did to a Russian school in Beslan. After the attack there were 344 people killed including 186 children. No town or city should be asked to absorb the risk.
ReplyDeleteAnonymous,
ReplyDeleteWhy haven't the jihadists already tried to do to us what the Chechens did to the Russians at the Beslan school? It may be that we don't share a common land border with the Middle East, while the Russians share a common land border with Chechnya that doesn't require international flights or ocean voyages to cross. If the jihadists could have attacked us again they would have. And if they could it doesn't matter where we put keep the prisoners. Whether we put the prisoners at Gitmo or Idaho, the terrorists have the same opportunity to stage a terrorist attack anytime anywhere in the U.S. and demand the release of the prisoners? They don't have to strike in the same location as the prison, and in fact, it's most likely that they would choose a different location. Why?
It's simple. The terrorists know that federal, state and local authorities would be on the lookout for any signs of something like that in and around the local area of the prison. They know we would be extra vigilant for just such a scenario anywhere near the prison. Their operational planners are not dummies. If they could pull of something in the U.S. they would choose a location we wouldn't be looking at and also a location with much bigger publicity attached to it, someplace like Disneyland in California or for ease of attack a hotel full of U.S. college students celebrating Springbreak in Cancun. They don't give a rat's rear end about hitting a target in Tonganoxie. They want someplace symbolic and in a major news market that will generat headlines world wide. That's why they struck the Trade towers in New York and not the grain silos in Salina. Anyone who thinks our local area somehow rates high on a terrorist target list is smoking something other than cigarettes. If you think a jihadist wants to go through all the planning, staging, logistics and risks to stage an international incident by targeting the Leavenworth public library, you might want to wonder how rational that sounds.
I don't have time or patience to read what your 15 other commenters have said.
ReplyDeleteBottom line, we need jobs just like everyone else. And imprisoning a few more is only good news for the metro. And once they're in jail they're just like any other prisoner and probably a lot less menacing than dudes that actually end up in a federal/military pen. Every one of these politicians who raised a ruckus around this just helped me figure out who is out of touch and should be worked against in the next election.